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Board Babysitters? - 4/9/2004 4:59:26 PM   
ProDomme


Posts: 50
Joined: 1/8/2004
Status: offline 		Ok, I have wanted to broach this subject on a few occasions, so now I am going to.

It seems that every time I open a thread to read there is someone commenting on anothers post. Telling them to read the rules, accusing them of trolling and what not. Well maybe not everytime, but a lot. Some of the posts are not trolling in my opinion, I could however be an idiot, time will tell.

Here is my bitch... there are times when I start reading and just simply close the thread because the "police" have been there and I cannot read any further. It pisses me off to be honest when I read a post from a thread Nazi berateing someone. Or repeating the rules for the 100th time. It would be a bit different if I only saw this on occasion and the initial post that is being policed was blatantly obnoxious or worthy of reiterating the rules. But geebus fuk, over and over, thread after thread. Get a life please!

Some are making themselves self-appointed mods, again my own opinion. I sometimes think that this type of shit is running off people, that if given a chance could produce decent conversation. So they make mistakes, we all do and will continue to, that's life.

That's my rant folks, now I shall await "MY" typing ticket, as I am sure there will be one


Chain

< Message edited by ProDomme -- 4/9/2004 4:59:56 PM >

_____________________________

And even in Darkness, There is Beauty.
Profile   Post #: 1
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 12:37:44 AM   
SherriA


Posts: 553
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		If people read the rules and read other threads before posting, hopefully they wouldn't post things that were contrary to the established guidelines. Unfortunately, many people come to the message boards to post "personal ads", without bothering to see what is and isn't welcome. If someone doesn't point this out to them, then how will they know, since they obviously don't read beforehand?

If they're genuine, they can always post an apology and then join in more appropriate discussions. Others have done just that. If all they were here for was to troll, then I for one will not miss their contributions.

-- Sherri

_____________________________

-- Sherri

Fighting for peace is like fucking for virginity.

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 2
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 2:03:38 AM   
inyouagain


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/6/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ProDomme
...I sometimes think that this type of shit is running off people, that if given a chance could produce decent conversation. So they make mistakes, we all do and will continue to, that's life.

Yeah, I can see how reminding someone of the rules they refuse to follow can run them off after they dropped their troll post and e-mail address (post count = 1). Geez if they'd only have been given a chance to follow up on their 1 post from a month ago... we might have another e-mail address for them, eh?

That's not exactly my idea of decent conversation, but to each their own...

SherriA gave you a nicely worded and quite lucid answer, and stated it rather well... but your chosen use of one particular phrase merits much more attention IMHO, and you won't like it.

In any decent organization, rules/guidelines apply to all members... not just the ones who acknowledge them. If this bothers you that some here do remind violators of the rules, perhaps a nice troll zone board like slavefarm would be more to your liking? They have old troll posts 3 years old being answered by new trolls... what decent conversation! All collarme has is a variety of topics, commentary and a growing group of somewhat nice, often helpful, and occasionally thoughtful people that don't necessarily cotton to those who feel the established collarme rules don't apply to them.

I highly disagree with your 'Thread Nazi' anaolgy/title/label/phrase, and would quickly refer you to a less controlled board where rules are posted for no reason at all, and not expected to be followed... where it's a free for all and nobody gives a damn.

Many folks here police after stray dogs shitting in our yard... it is not a conspiracy against stray dogs, but simply a compliance issue.

If you have a problem with the rules, take it up with the board admin.

If you have a problem with those members who tend to enforce the board's rules on the 'rules challenged' oblivious and self-priviledged ones, then a less concerned board membership may be the only cure for your rant. Your options would be to completely change members here, or completely change the board you choose to frequent in getting yourself a life.

Thank you for your opinion, but you don't present a more suitable alternative, and your rant remains simply a rant.

You used the term Nazi. Would things have been any different in WWII had more concerned bystanders took exception to the trainloads of people being hauled away daily to extermination camps? Have you ever been to see the handywork of Nazi's? I have, Dachau and Auschwitz are not very nice places, even 60 years later the human skin lampshades are still quite appalling!

Your use of the term Nazi with regards to people who try to prevent abuse here is IMHO just plain idiotic, uninformed, and unappreciative... and to attempt to parallel events that murdered millions and destroyed millions of other innocent lives... comparing that to getting onto a troll's ass on this board is indeed curious and highly questionable.

btw, I read your profile and journal. You state often in your journal your dislike of those 'stupid people' who send you messages that are not within your prescribed rules/guidelines. Do you have a different philosophy here on the message board?

Please don't even get me started...

Inyouagain

< Message edited by inyouagain -- 4/10/2004 5:06:51 AM >

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 3
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 7:04:04 AM   
ProDomme


Posts: 50
Joined: 1/8/2004
Status: offline
quote:

Your options would be to completely change members here, or completely change the board you choose to frequent in getting yourself a life.



I have no need to change members, and I have a life. But thank you for graciously proving my point.


In essence you just told me to either come back with a different name and post so that my words appease you, or just go away. You my friend are entirely far too self important.

_____________________________

And even in Darkness, There is Beauty.

(in reply to inyouagain)
Profile   Post #: 4
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 8:17:45 AM   
sub4hire


Posts: 3834
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		I think you're missing the simplest point of all here. If you see the same post telling someone about the rules. You know beforehand what is in that post in its entirety.

Skip through it into the next post or the next. Nobody is telling you that you have to read it.
I know if I am replying to a post I skip over many at times. Some, I just have no comment on.

You can't change the world. Neither can I. You do have the right to bitch about it, like you did. People are not going to change.

_____________________________

"The dumbest people I know are those who know it all."

Malcolm Forbes

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 5
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 8:20:07 AM   
MizSuz


Posts: 1416
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ProDomme


quote:

ORIGINAL: inyouagain

Your options would be to completely change members here, or completely change the board you choose to frequent in getting yourself a life.



In essence you just told me to either come back with a different name and post so that my words appease you, or just go away.



I didn't read him the way you did, I think. I read him saying either change the members here or find another board that better suits you.

The difference of opinions, however, is easy to spot.

_____________________________

Suz

In honor of the impending ski season: If you're not livin' on the edge you're takin' up too much space!

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 6
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 8:27:53 AM   
ProDomme


Posts: 50
Joined: 1/8/2004
Status: offline 		Actually I think my point was missed, but ahh well.

I have no desire to change anyone on this board, most of the regulars here I enjoy reading.

And I have no problem with the "policing" (for lack of a better term) when needed. However I have read posts from others asking questions, only to be hit over the head immediatly. The poly family one comes to mind. Why trash others and call it cleaning you're back yard. It is apparant there are some that really enjoy reading every single thread looking for a chance to police it, or degrade someone, or just plain be an asshole.

Again, only my opinion.

And for the record the term "Thread (post) Nazi" is widely used on the internet, it makes no infereance to Germany. It simply means you show up in 90% of the threads, correcting someone, berateing them or flashing the rules sign, over and over and over.

< Message edited by ProDomme -- 4/10/2004 8:32:19 AM >

_____________________________

And even in Darkness, There is Beauty.

(in reply to MizSuz)
Profile   Post #: 7
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 8:50:03 AM   
inyouagain


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/6/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ProDomme
quote:

Your options would be to completely change members here, or completely change the board you choose to frequent in getting yourself a life.


I have no need to change members, and I have a life. But thank you for graciously proving my point.

In essence you just told me to either come back with a different name and post so that my words appease you, or just go away. You my friend are entirely far too self important.

I said "members" (as in other members here who don't cotton to rules violators), not your "membership" here. The words you try to put in my mouth are incorrect... I never told you to change your membership or come back as a different member to appease anyone here... those are your gracious words in attempt to prove your point, not mine.

Here's what I stated:
quote:


If you have a problem with those members who tend to enforce the board's rules on the 'rules challenged' oblivious and self-priviledged ones, then a less concerned board membership may be the only cure for your rant. Your options would be to completely change members here, or completely change the board you choose to frequent in getting yourself a life.

Meaning that if you have heartburn with members here keeping trolls honest, your options for finding a less GAS (give a shit) factor board would be to change many other members here (excluding yourself, you would stay and we would go)... or change the board itself (you go in search of a more free-for-all, rules optional board), where your rant and label dropping would be accommodated better.

I did not introduce the "Thread Nazi" label, you chose to do that, and by doing so you will receive feedback and opinion regarding Nazi's. Although I an not Jewish, in numerous other posts on this board, many members stated they are Jewish, and some offense was apparently taken by some in the Slave Registry thread (regarding tattoo'ing of a slave with a number or barcode). The subject you introduced was (and still is) a serious reminder of the holocaust to many victims and families worldwide, and a powerful reminder to those not directly affected, but who have witnessed the actual extermination camps used by the Nazi's.

Self-importance really is not the issue, it's more your own negative judgements and rant concerning other members who do not wish to see this board become a troll zone wasteland like many other boards. Further, you compounded your stance by tossing out the Nazi label.

If I said that you looked like a cow, you would be offended.

If I said that your sight was like a cow's sight, you would not be offended.

Your choice of words brought feedback and opinion, so it would seem you have accomplished your intended purpose by writing them.

Inyouagain

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 8
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 9:17:01 AM   
inyouagain


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/6/2004
Status: offline 		Oh please... let's try not to get personal. Others saw my point while you totally missed it, so perhaps you read too fast?

If you missed that, then it's obvious you don't see when someone posts a "looking for polys to start a poly family" post (and never posts again), their true interest does not appear to be finding out about the pro's/con's of polyamorous relationships... rather apparently to solicit here and experience them first. Truly interested people usually tend to post more than just one single post weeks ago, agreed?

I have no comment on your defense of using the Nazi label.

Actually, when SherriA stated some people had trolled, appologized and have become contributing members... there was only one who did so, and immediately started trolling again after appoligizing, and has since disappeared. The actual count is Zero of those who were in fact making serious inquiries, versus simply trolling.

Funny how those who start these problems are usually never around to see the outcome.

Inyouagain

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 9
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 9:37:16 AM   
MizSuz


Posts: 1416
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		I can't argue with the notion that often it seems that some people are natural dissenters. I can't even argue with finding it bothersome, but I do try to remember that if I'm not in agreement with a thread, if the thread doesn't interest me, or if it seems that the original poster was just 'trolling' then I have the option of not participating. It's an option I often avail myself of.

I would, however, hate to see the vast majority of postings become simply personal ads. If that were to happen I would stop participating in the boards all together. I do believe that the policing we've seen by regulars has aided in keeping that down. I also agree that sometimes it seems the policing happens too quickly without giving the thread time to shake out whether the original poster was genuine or not. I have seen many poorly worded posts that bespeak more of the unappeased desires of the poster than their quest for information.

As inyouagain points out, it's quite possible for those original posters to clarify themselves. Many have chosen not to. I'd bet the majority of it is because they were trolling to begin with; but I do not discount the possibility that at least some were simply run off by the level of dissent confronting them. Some who have spoken out only affirmed that they were trolling in their justifications of same.

To those people who simply sounded like trolls, but did not mean it I say, Step Up and Speak Out! If they do not then they only leave us to wonder, if we bother at all.

_____________________________

Suz

In honor of the impending ski season: If you're not livin' on the edge you're takin' up too much space!

(in reply to inyouagain)
Profile   Post #: 10
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 12:12:58 PM   
ProDomme


Posts: 50
Joined: 1/8/2004
Status: offline 		>Truly interested people usually tend to post more than just one single post weeks ago, agreed<





Post went up on the 8th, you hit it on the 9th. And I am almost sure you were thinking of posting sooner than you did. According to my calander there are 7 days per week, so said post would not have been "weeks" old. So therefore, I disagree.


What is astounding to me is that I made no implications as to who I felt guilty of the practice, yet look how it turned out ;)


I think you are wrong for attacking some of the posts, I think you should allow some of them to go without your input for a little more time than you do. As I have already stated, I have no issues with the obvious posts that merit reiterating the rules, hell they probably did not read them in the first place.

I am also in agreement that I would hate to see "personal ads" in almost every thread. I however can see where some may come here with the thought that this is a place to do so. They link here from the main page, and possibly think this is a larger forum to put up what they want or do not want. Some in fact are blatantly disregarding the board rules, some have made honest mistakes. And when the honest mistakes are addressed in the way they sometimes are, hell I would not blame them for not coming back.


Again, only my opinions, but sometimes things are said too harsh or too quickly. I have a right to that opinion and you can twist it anyway you like. I brought it here to the lounge, because it was my opinion, and did not feel it belonged in general discussion.

_____________________________

And even in Darkness, There is Beauty.

(in reply to MizSuz)
Profile   Post #: 11
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/10/2004 4:00:29 PM   
EStrict


Posts: 730
Joined: 1/11/2004
Status: offline 		Actually, I see things I agree with in all the posts. I do believe people here often put down, denigrate or jump on someone because *they* read it as a troll post. It's one of the biggest problems with dealing with a 3 dimensional people in a 2 dimensional medium, is you can often read into a post something that isn't meant.

Pro is correct that the one post was there a very little time and with no practical advice there yet before the person was accused of trolling. If you were the person, would you really want to respond again if people where going to misinterpret everything you said and jump down you throat for it?

I am the first to admit I am a stickler for the rules, but if someone else has already pointed out that post breaks the rules, I see no reason to add to that unless I am (hopefully) adding something constructive to the original poster.

_____________________________

Sandy

Don't take life too seriously, no one gets out alive anyway...

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 12
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 5:55:52 AM   
inyouagain


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/6/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ProDomme
>Truly interested people usually tend to post more than just one single post weeks ago, agreed<

Post went up on the 8th, you hit it on the 9th. And I am almost sure you were thinking of posting sooner than you did. According to my calander there are 7 days per week, so said post would not have been "weeks" old. So therefore, I disagree.

I made a reference in my reply, that the post infers the plan was backwards (seeking people vs. seeking info), and that is often referred to as trolling, especially with one total post on the board.

For the record I did not say "your breaking the rules, quit trolling". Your opinion of what I said, or how I may have "hit" the post sooner or later seems to be somewhat biased (as you stated you figured you were sure of what I was thinking).

quote:


What is astounding to me is that I made no implications as to who I felt guilty of the practice, yet look how it turned out ;)

Your implications came in your subsequent posts, not really very astounding.

quote:


I think you are wrong for attacking some of the posts, I think you should allow some of them to go without your input for a little more time than you do. As I have already stated, I have no issues with the obvious posts that merit reiterating the rules, hell they probably did not read them in the first place.

Thank you for your biased opinion. From your comments throughout this thread, your bias is somewhat obvious, and your bias compells your opinion as self-fulfilling.

You may have seen me in difference of opinion with other members, but you don't get the option of pushing the stereotype of "attacking" posts on me, sorry. Save that for the members who "attack" grammar, punctuation and spellling, or the effective use of the english language by the poster, versus the jist of the post... those welcomes are "attacks".

quote:


I am also in agreement that I would hate to see "personal ads" in almost every thread. I however can see where some may come here with the thought that this is a place to do so. They link here from the main page, and possibly think this is a larger forum to put up what they want or do not want. Some in fact are blatantly disregarding the board rules, some have made honest mistakes. And when the honest mistakes are addressed in the way they sometimes are, hell I would not blame them for not coming back.

Ditto what I said above concerning how posts are frequently "attacked" over grammar, punctuation and spelling... use of shorthand, etc. No, that's not me you see doing that kind of welcome treatment is it? So why compare my lack of patience for trolls to those here who bitchslap newbies over cosmetics? That's not really even fair, and entirely out of context.

quote:


Again, only my opinions, but sometimes things are said too harsh or too quickly. I have a right to that opinion and you can twist it anyway you like. I brought it here to the lounge, because it was my opinion, and did not feel it belonged in general discussion.

I know you will love hearing this, but IMHO, your opinion is somewhat biased and stereotyped as you have demonstrated in this thread.

I tend to welcome trolls with reminders of the established rules here... I don't go around slapping newbies in the face and "attacking" them for word cosmetics. Those members are still here and their threads/posts also... please go read them again sometime, and let's give credit where credit is due.

IMHO, much of the hostility you speak of towards newbies is not demonstrated on trolls, but demonstrated on new members who's word cosmetics do not sit well with other members here.

All in all, I'm glad this whole thing came up actually. It is indeed time to set the record straight and place the treatment of newer members in the spotlight... trolls place themselves in the spotlight by intent/design, so their welcome treatment is expected.

Perhaps it's time we all take a serious look at our approach shots, evaluate the post intent, what's inside of it... versus judge it by it's packaging? But it does seem that higher standards are expected from dominants, including mastering grammar, punctuation and spelling... a good wordsmith makes a good spindoctor, that's the right philosophy, right? Is that what we are all about here?

I for one hope not!

Inyouagain

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 13
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 6:21:25 AM   
ProDomme


Posts: 50
Joined: 1/8/2004
Status: offline 		Instead of shifting blame, why not take responsability for your own participation in said acts. Oh that's right, you are not wrong, never have been, never will be.


As far as my being biased, you are simply trying to find a way to somehow not be the guilty party here.

So it was thier first post, and this makes them a troll, why? Maybe they found the board, and were seeking information. Is there a rule somewhere that says you must post a certain number of posts before you can pose a question. We may very well never know if they were "trolling" or not, after that warm welcome they may not come back.

As far as the grammar police go, on several larger boards that will get you on probation status. It is impolite to pick at someones education or application of it. A great many could use some manners, they certainly wouldn't verbaly reprimand someone in real life because they used a word wrong in conversation. Not someone they don't know very well anyway.

My point was simple, some are far too harsh on this board when new people come. And it irritates me when it is done, as it does others at times.


Thumbnail Image


Attachment (1)

< Message edited by ProDomme -- 4/11/2004 6:21:58 AM >

_____________________________

And even in Darkness, There is Beauty.

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Profile   Post #: 14
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 6:44:43 AM   
LadyBeckett


Posts: 830
Joined: 2/4/2004
From: Scotland/Tennessee
Status: offline
I have read this discussion from the beginning and found it fascinating. I can actually understand it from all sides, but the truth is the policing is absolutely necessary otherwise this place would be literally rife with trash and nonsense. If they let a little bit trickle through the next thing you know it's an avalanche.

The message boards are a wonderful feature and while I don't get over here often, I do come and read from time to time. I applaud the individuals who come over here and dedicate the time to maintain them.

That was My two cents.

Lady Beckett

< Message edited by LadyBeckett -- 4/11/2004 6:46:11 AM >

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 15
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 7:25:19 AM   
iwillserveu


Posts: 1641
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		I won’t attempt to justify others (I can’t) but since I am usually in that posse I’ll speak for myself. I try to be non-judgmental and give a clear way out. {I can’t (or won’t) speak for anyone else.}

I think that 90% of “trolls” just didn’t read the instructions. That, in and of itself, is understandable in an age where the toaster comes with an 8-page booklet of instructions. (C’mon, who has read the book that came with their DVD player from cover to cover? [{Including the section on the FCC compliance? })

_____________________________

When the Lady smiles i can't resist her call. As a matter of fact, i don't resist at all. Well that depends if it is a smile or a grimmace.

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 16
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 8:07:35 AM   
inyouagain


Posts: 427
Joined: 1/6/2004
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ProDomme
Instead of shifting blame, why not take responsability for your own participation in said acts. Oh that's right, you are not wrong, never have been, never will be.

As far as my being biased, you are simply trying to find a way to somehow not be the guilty party here.

Amusing ProPolice, lol, the badge may be overkill though, but it's obviously indicative of the nucleus to your own posse.

I accept responsibility for what I do, not what you think I do in your astonishment. I openly talk about kicking blatant troll butts. Of course I've made mistakes and I appologized, that is no secret.

As far as allowing you to shove your perceived guilt onto me, sorry won't happen in my lifetime.

quote:


So it was thier first post, and this makes them a troll, why? Maybe they found the board, and were seeking information. Is there a rule somewhere that says you must post a certain number of posts before you can pose a question. We may very well never know if they were "trolling" or not, after that warm welcome they may not come back.

You must have missed that in my last post above... the part about his post appearing to have the plan backwards, seeking polys vs. poly info... I can't make it much simpler, sorry. No he was not accused of being a troll. Yes he was given the "out" of reiterating or expanding upon the comments in his post.

Maybe if a frog had wings, he wouldn't bump his ass when he jumps.

You want to deal with maybe's, ok fine. Maybe the post author is a troll? Maybe the post author is the Pope? Maybe I was the post author under alias, as well as all the trolls that have wandered through... maybe it's all me, simply entertaining myself and pissing in your grits? Maybe, maybe not?

quote:


As far as the grammar police go, on several larger boards that will get you on probation status. It is impolite to pick at someones education or application of it. A great many could use some manners, they certainly wouldn't verbaly reprimand someone in real life because they used a word wrong in conversation. Not someone they don't know very well anyway.

As I pointed out above... but you seem to prefer to mention it yourself now, how odd.

quote:


My point was simple, some are far too harsh on this board when new people come. And it irritates me when it is done, as it does others at times.

Your simple point was cast towards members who respond to trolls, reminding them of the established board policies... like 100 times, etc.

You used the word "rules" three different times, and the word "trolling" two different times... and your post was a rant, a bitch towards what you perceived to be self-appointed mods... no mention of "word police" or simple discourtesy (read it again).

Did you say something above about shifting blame? Oh yes you certainly did... as you should very well know about that aspect... that's how you started this thread!

How much does your cop job pay? Do you get bennies?

Inyouagain

< Message edited by inyouagain -- 4/11/2004 11:08:35 AM >

(in reply to ProDomme)
Profile   Post #: 17
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 1:47:55 PM   
Estring


Posts: 1266
Joined: 1/1/2004
Status: offline 		LadyBeckett, that looks like 4 cents to me.
Profile   Post #: 18
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 4:42:15 PM   
ProDomme


Posts: 50
Joined: 1/8/2004
Status: offline 		I left the police department last year, as a result of far too much overtime and no overtime pay. Some municipalities can get away with it using "cival servant" as thier basis. And the benifits just were not that great. ;)

_____________________________

And even in Darkness, There is Beauty.

(in reply to Estring)
Profile   Post #: 19
RE: Board Babysitters? - 4/11/2004 7:48:47 PM   
LadyBeckett


Posts: 830
Joined: 2/4/2004
From: Scotland/Tennessee
Status: offline 		Estring, I admit the reason I don't post more is because it takes me a while to figure these boards out. I did attempt to delete that second one, and I'll be darned if I know how I even did that. You're right, it was four cents. I suppose this is two more which brings me up to six.

_____________________________

Lady Beckett

_____________________________________

"Submissive boys yearn to fall into their proper place, so that the rest of their life will." ~ Lady Beckett

(in reply to Estring)
Profile   Post #: 20
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