RE: BDSM Saint?

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 8:20:07 AM

darkangel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

Ya know, i do not think i come in "parts"; i am a whole person, and love God just as i do my friends and my hopes for a Dom and Master.

But here's a good question: why aren't there more Native American and African-American saints?

candystripper

There are many 'saints' in all denominations and religions and beliefs... it doesnt need one churches say so to make them so...

Hugs my friend
Peace and Rapture.

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 8:22:15 AM

darkangel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrDiscipline44

I just don't see the point. This is a nice story and all but it has no relevance to BDSM or any lifestyle. This woman wasn't a martyr for BDSM, she wasn't a slave because it drew her to it. She was not made a saint because she loved kinky sex. Religon may be apart of you as it is for many, candy, but this just doesn't has relevance to anyone but you.

Its relevant to one - it is relevant to many - trying to make a post seem uselss just because it does not apply to you is a form of control that fortunately, not all are willing to accept.

It has relevance to those who see it - or wish to understand.
One just has to look deeper if one has the desire to understand. If not - ignore - move on.
I personally do not see the relevance of trying to dismiss something, just because You cannot understand it.

Peace and Rapture

< Message edited by darkangel -- 2/9/2006 8:28:29 AM >

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Post #: 22

RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 8:34:13 AM

IronBear

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quote:

ORIGINAL: MrDiscipline44

IronBear, my post was to the thread title and subsequent story by the OP in general and not to the conversation between you and candy specificly. I apologize for any confusion. And as I said, although BDSM and religon is part of the OP as it is for many, the story has no BDSM reference what so ever. Therefore the title of BDSM Saint is misleading and unwarrented.

No apology necessary my friend, and thank you for the explanation, the post makes much more sence now.... Must be lack of sleep which bluntens my perception.

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 8:35:38 AM

Mercnbeth

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quote:

This saint's story makes me feel at peace with both my sexuality and my sprituality.

maybe you could expand a bit more as to how?

for what it is worth, this slave doesn't personally believe in elevating any former human beings above the other, they might have been great servants and represent an ideal, but they are no holier than the rest of the dead, may they RIP~think it was that firm Protestant upbringing?

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 8:58:31 AM

darkangel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mercnbeth

quote:

This saint's story makes me feel at peace with both my sexuality and my sprituality.

maybe you could expand a bit more as to how?

for what it is worth, this slave doesn't personally believe in elevating any former human beings above the other, they might have been great servants and represent an ideal, but they are no holier than the rest of the dead, may they RIP~think it was that firm Protestant upbringing?

I personally dont see any mention of holiness... other in your post. Maybe I am misunderstanding.

I do elevate others... but not to worship - but to follow. We all elevate people - else we would never learn. They are our teachers and our guides. If we growl in disgust at the hateful way minorities treat certain individuals and see them as the lowest of the low... then it is safe to say that there will be others raised up because of what they do and how they achieve and how they shape their lives... and ours...

Jesus
Rosa Parks
Martin Luther
Ghandi
Your Own Master...

By simply being owned - You already elevated One mans status...

Peace and Rapture.

< Message edited by darkangel -- 2/9/2006 8:59:29 AM >

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 9:34:34 AM

HouseDiscipline

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quote:

ORIGINAL: darkangel
Its relevant to one - it is relevant to many - trying to make a post seem uselss just because it does not apply to you is a form of control that fortunately, not all are willing to accept.

It has relevance to those who see it - or wish to understand.
One just has to look deeper if one has the desire to understand. If not - ignore - move on.
I personally do not see the relevance of trying to dismiss something, just because You cannot understand it.

I'm not trying to make the post seem to be anything. I am stating the I see no point in the post, that the title is misleading and that the post as a whole does not have any bearing on BDSM. This is a discussion forum and as said many times, one may post to a discussion if one wishes to. Whether you like it or not, it is open to all. Whether they are opposed or for the OP, all may post. I don't have to look deeper if the one posting does not have to post a clearer statement to understand. If you can't take opposition to your point of view then you need to take your own advice of ignore and move on. Also, I don't see the point of dismissing someone that does not understand just because you can not explain your stand point.

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Post #: 26

RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 10:00:58 AM

FTopinMichigan

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quote:

ORIGINAL: IronBear

WHY????????????????????????????

Because I'm an atheist!

No ulterior religion in my motive to post.
K

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Post #: 27

RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 10:20:48 AM

darkangel

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I never dissmissed your point of view. I asked You about.

Your post is relevant in stating you view of irrelevancy... and I responded to it.
The OP is relevant to those that would see it. You obviously do not. That is Your prerogative to yourself. But to make a sweeping generalisation that the title is misleading is choosing what others think.

For me, It didnt mislead. Its didnt seem irrelevant. For You it may be, for myself and for a handful of others, it is a specifically important post. I am blessed to have read it but I wouldnt expect everyone to feel the same way. For me it was an informal piece of information on TPE. I wouldnt dream of trying to tell someone what it meant to them, only for me. I would dream of making such sweeping statements such as

quote:

but this just doesn't has relevance to anyone but you.

quote:

This is a nice story and all but it has no relevance to BDSM or any lifestyle

(It may have been more helpful to state 'This is a nice story and all but it has no relevance to BDSM or any lifestyle for myself' )

So before you start twisting words that were never said - and choosing what others think for them - try and concentrate on your personal view for yourself... or try and reword your postings so they are not so labeling.

*CM Disclaimer - these are MY ideas, and MY thoughts... not the views of the ENTIRE BDSM or human population or what YOU think should think or do think... (doncha just lurve that disclaimer?)... lets hope you are getting my - personal - point.

Peace and Love

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Post #: 28

RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 11:02:41 AM

candystripper

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quote:

Sorry if I seem a bit harsh here, but they are a particular bête noire of mine. There is something awesomely not right about people who go into a foreign culture and demand that the locals give up their traditional religion and withhold needed food and medical care if the locals don't.

JohnWareen

One of many reasons i am fairly certain i am leaving the Church, Sir.

candystripper

< Message edited by candystripper -- 2/9/2006 11:03:08 AM >

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 11:54:22 AM

Mercnbeth

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quote:

I personally dont see any mention of holiness... other in your post. Maybe I am misunderstanding...orig: darkangel

always happy to help ya', darkangel!!! from the OP:

quote:

Catholic saints are holy people...orig:Candystripper

this slave was offering her own opinion on the concept of saints, in reference to the above.

quote:

By simply being owned - You already elevated One mans status...

this slave thinks you are stretching what she said...the elevation you allude to this slave sees as respecting someone, their accomplishments, telling the story of their personal sacrifice, cherishing their memory, all that is great---but elevating them to "holy" status above other folk who are just as much the Great Architects creation and fulfilling their purpose..well, this slave just doesn't agree with it.

edited for typos

< Message edited by Mercnbeth -- 2/9/2006 11:55:48 AM >

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 12:03:18 PM

slavejali

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I've met lots of Saints in India who werent catholic...but a lot of their experiences are very similar to ones I have read of Catholic Saints.

I dont see anything wrong with posting about religion or spirituality. If its part of someones life and they want to share, cool. Those who have no connection with a certain topic just need not post to that particularly one.

I liked the story of the slave saint candy, thanks for posting it.

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Post #: 31

RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 1:40:40 PM

NeedToUseYou

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hmmm, not seeing how this relates to BDSM either. She was a forced slave not willing. The only part that was voluntary, and thus related to BDSM is her devotion to God. On top of it, it says in the original post that she worked to free female slaves. So, even if you were equating real slave to that of a BDSM slave. She'd been working against BDSM not for it? So, not sure how she'd be a BDSM saint. Maybe a Saint but nothing to do with BDSM.

Anyway, that's how I read it.

***Non-Flame disclaimer****

The opinions expressed above are those solely of NeedToUseYou, and don't necessarily reflect any others. The opinions expressed, aren't intended to force someone elses opinion to conform within those stated. NeedToUseYou, is way full of himself and expects others to view all comments from that standpoint.

***End Non-Flame disclaimer*****

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 2:38:09 PM

bear372217355

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quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

Ya know, i do not think i come in "parts"; i am a whole person, and love God just as i do my friends and my hopes for a Dom and Master.

But here's a good question: why aren't there more Native American and African-American saints?

candystripper

Being active in the Native community here in Ontario Canada, I can honestly say... I don't know, but now that you mention it, I'm going to investigate that to see how many there are or are not.

My first assumption is that much like myself, many Native Canadians turned there backs on the various churches once they were able to. We were not treated very well by the various religious organizations, and that may play a big part in the reasons why. That's not to say that all Natives reverted back to the tradtional ways of worship. Many of our brightest leaders and elders are quite involved in the church.

Very good question, thanks for the eye opening thought.

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 9:27:12 PM

Wildfleurs

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quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

Sir, as a rule, Catholic Missions will not dispense medicine, education or food unless the individual converts. Seems as iof there should be tons of RC African-Americans and Native Americans from the 17th and 18th centuries.

i read "The Lives of the Saints" many years ago, and seems to me we were canonizimg plently of people who were no more than martyrs.

candystripper

Why would there be? During those times the exposure came as part of the colonization (ie taking over) of countries and regions - why would someone really want to be a part of that religion (except to get over or gain favor)?

C~

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 9:32:55 PM

truesub4u

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This one learned... religon... politics... friends.. don't mix to well... so i'll just read....

And keep opinions to my self.... on the religious aspects of it all

(specially sense she's got no damn idea what the hell she would be say no ways)

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 9:47:32 PM

candystripper

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quote:

Why would there be? During those times the exposure came as part of the colonization (ie taking over) of countries and regions - why would someone really want to be a part of that religion (except to get over or gain favor)?

C~

Do you mean why did people convert? Out of desparation, i assume. Do you mean why did the Church engage in this policy? Myself, i think it's a disrespect for 3rd world cultures.

candystripper

< Message edited by candystripper -- 2/9/2006 9:48:07 PM >

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 10:05:39 PM

Crazytwice

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Candy,

Why did you title the thread "BDSM Saint" ?

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/9/2006 11:08:41 PM

IronBear

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quote:

ORIGINAL: candystripper

quote:

Why would there be? During those times the exposure came as part of the colonization (ie taking over) of countries and regions - why would someone really want to be a part of that religion (except to get over or gain favor)?

C~

Do you mean why did people convert? Out of desparation, i assume. Do you mean why did the Church engage in this policy? Myself, i think it's a disrespect for 3rd world cultures.

candystripper

I'd say the conversion started a lot earlier. The Christian Church Movement (Ok it was the Catholic Church) started to convert and change people in every location they had a foothold in that country. In many cases, they simply "Adopted" holy placey and made the Old Ones (Goods and Goddesses) Saints or deliverately built cathedrals over our (Pagan) sacred sites. never forget that Lourdes and the attached Lady was originally a sacred healing site for the Pagans with it's attached Goddess. The same with St Bridgit and her well in Ireland. Stone the crows, wven 98% oif the Catholid Mass is of Pagan Origin. Strangely enough many of the best Pagan Priestesses are good old Catholoc girls who converted to Wicca and other forms of Paganism. (They uderstand the concept of the Goddess ~ Virgin Mary ~ and have a love of ritual.

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/10/2006 4:10:50 AM

ExistentialSteel

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I would have kept her a slave and trained her to like it. She would have never given it up to become a nun or whatever it was. She would have lived happily ever after being used by her owner.

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RE: BDSM Saint? - 2/10/2006 9:25:19 AM

candystripper

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i thought she had been a slave..and found a real Master. Plus, she had a great story, i thought.

candystripper

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