Topping fron the bottom

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Topping fron the bottom - 1/29/2006 11:34:43 AM

Alan101

Posts: 3
Joined: 12/7/2005
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Some advice, please. How do you stop a bottom from trying to top?
Thanks.
Alan

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RE: Topping fron the bottom - 1/29/2006 11:39:59 AM

KatyLied

Posts: 1512
Joined: 2/24/2005
From: Pennsylvania
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I think we need more specific information regarding your situation.

Have you discussed this with your sub? Have you punished your sub for the infraction(s)?
Do you set aside time when your sub is free to talk to you about things without the threat that she is trying to "top" you?

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/29/2006 11:58:13 AM

JohnWarren

Posts: 1931
Joined: 3/18/2005
From: Delray Beach, FL
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alan101

Some advice, please. How do you stop a bottom from trying to top?
Thanks.
Alan

You simply don't allow it. People repeat behaviors that are successful. If the success rate is zero, the behavior quickly vanishes.

If a submissive does something that displeases me, I explain that I am displeased and why. If the behavior continues, I reevaluate the relationship.

< Message edited by JohnWarren -- 1/29/2006 12:00:42 PM >

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/29/2006 12:13:26 PM

Real0ne

Posts: 401
Joined: 10/25/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnWarren

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alan101

Some advice, please. How do you stop a bottom from trying to top?
Thanks.
Alan

You simply don't allow it. People repeat behaviors that are successful. If the success rate is zero, the behavior quickly vanishes.

If a submissive does something that displeases me, I explain that I am displeased and why. If the behavior continues, I reevaluate the relationship.

i ditto that, i also think you need to look at yourself your style and abilities and what form of authority figure your bottom respects that is if your bottom is even a bottom or submissive at all. i am not saying this to put anything on you but there are many levels of af aggression/passivity if you will in domination and some people are totally nonagressive dominants. For example if you are a nonagressive dominant, and your sub needs to be tossed around to feel controlled you may not be a proper match for each other or negotiation would be in order. i think you may want to consider talking with your sub to see what it takes to control them, and hope it is within your style to do so. Last recourse is reevaluate the play and possibly even the relationship as john pointed out.

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/30/2006 1:29:53 AM

Alan101

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Joined: 12/7/2005
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These are really helpful comments. Some examples are: when I tell her to sit on her hands becuse she's been fiddling, she sticks her tongue out; when I send her to face the wall before, during or after a spenking session, she refuses to keep still but wiggles her bottom. I feel that if I punish her harder, I may do more damage than I really want to - I'm not a sadist

!
Cheers
Alan

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/30/2006 2:12:51 AM

CuriousPuppy

Posts: 51
Joined: 6/20/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alan101

These are really helpful comments. Some examples are: when I tell her to sit on her hands becuse she's been fiddling, she sticks her tongue out; when I send her to face the wall before, during or after a spenking session, she refuses to keep still but wiggles her bottom. I feel that if I punish her harder, I may do more damage than I really want to - I'm not a sadist !
Cheers
Alan

Have her open her mouth wide, (loosely) tie a bow/ribbon around her tongue, and state that her tongue has to stay touching her top lip and possibly that the bow has to stay dry even. If she can't lower her tongue back down, the insides of her mouth will start to become rather uncomfortable as it dries out within the first 5-10 minutes... eventually drooling perhaps as well since it's rather difficult to swallow without the help of your tongue. I've no idea how healthy it is for someone to do that regularly, but my dentist didn't seem to find it as something I should worry about while I was having my root canal a while back. Stick out your tongue, that's the punishment.

Wiggles her bottom after a spanking? let her, but start out by going to a hobby/autoparts shop and get some of the super-fine sandpaper and support it on something so it's pressed against the freshly spanked area. A hinge, a couple boards, a bit of padding, a bungee cord to keep it pressed against her backside, could be done pretty cheaply or very in depth if need be. The superfine sandpapers go all the way from about as rough as a sheet of paper to something like a rather rough nail file it seems, lots of room to grow in there before needing to move into something that could really cause damage.

Of course these are just sleepy attempts to think of uncomfortable punishments involving the activities you mentioned without actually causing any damage. Now that my laundry is ready to go into the dryer I can go to sleep :)

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/30/2006 5:19:26 AM

MstrssPassion

Posts: 524
Joined: 1/1/2004
From: West Palm Beach, FL
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The small amount of information you provided does not paint a clear picture as to what is going on or as to the type of relationship you have with her. She is obviously getting something she wants out of the situation or this behavior would not continue. Maybe she thinks her bratty behavior is cute. There really is no way to determine whether this is failure on your part or blatant defiance on her part.

I would suggest a very long sit down with her. Place all of your expectations on both sides down on paper. If you came to a decision that neither of your expectations are going to be met then it is time to dissolve this element of your involvement since you two would obviously have a different thought as to how your D/s relationship should work.

The simple fact of one person identifying as a dominant & one person identifying as a submissive isn't enough to form a relationship. Some dominants seek out bratty subs, some don't. Some submissives seek out dominants that will enforce structure & behavior modification & some don't.

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/30/2006 7:06:22 AM

thetammyjo

Posts: 851
Joined: 9/8/2005
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alan101

These are really helpful comments. Some examples are: when I tell her to sit on her hands becuse she's been fiddling, she sticks her tongue out; when I send her to face the wall before, during or after a spenking session, she refuses to keep still but wiggles her bottom. I feel that if I punish her harder, I may do more damage than I really want to - I'm not a sadist !
Cheers
Alan

Hhmmmm.... reads to me like your "punishments" are what she wants.

You may need to change what you do in response. If she doesn't do something you've ordered, walk away and ignore her until she does it. If she doesn't live with you, get her coat or her purse or whatever, take her collar off and tell her to leave until she decides she actually wants to be your submissive.

She reads like the "brat" category of bottom to me and it reads like you aren't interested in having that dynamic. It could be that frankly your style or needs don't match. It could be that she just doesn't realize how annoyed you are because you feed her by punishing her in the ways you mention.

You can try talking to her but it seems that physical reaction is not working. The attitude is the problem and attitude, in my experience, is best dealt with by being ignored or separated for a time if talking doesn't help.

My advice may not be very good because the first time someone disobeyed me as you've written, that's the second to last time they'd do it. If after I explained that I expect their best behavior and obedience and they acted up again, the door would be opened, they'd be told to leave, and that would be the end.

I find this sort of behavior to be emotionally draining.

What do you find the behavior to be, Alan101? When you answer that, I think you'll have a much clearer idea of what to do.

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/30/2006 8:49:17 AM

yourMissTress

Posts: 541
Joined: 6/14/2005
From: Nashville, TN
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnWarren

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alan101

Some advice, please. How do you stop a bottom from trying to top?
Thanks.
Alan

You simply don't allow it. People repeat behaviors that are successful. If the success rate is zero, the behavior quickly vanishes.

If a submissive does something that displeases me, I explain that I am displeased and why. If the behavior continues, I reevaluate the relationship.

Again, John is right on the money. You are the Dom, you set the boundaries and expectations of behavior.

From the sounds of it, she's trying to be cute/bratty and maybe is trying to "earn" more punishment. The more you play into her hands the worse it's going to get. Find a punishment for these behaviors that she will not like...AT ALL, and then enforce it. Each and every sub has different buttons, what's punishment to one is exactly what another craves.

< Message edited by yourMissTress -- 1/30/2006 8:51:05 AM >

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/30/2006 1:59:47 PM

LthrdWolf

Posts: 88
Joined: 1/23/2006
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JohnWarren

You simply don't allow it. People repeat behaviors that are successful. If the success rate is zero, the behavior quickly vanishes.

If a submissive does something that displeases me, I explain that I am displeased and why. If the behavior continues, I reevaluate the relationship.

Well put John I also agree -totally.

LthrdWolf

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RE: Topping from the bottom - 1/30/2006 4:46:19 PM

MistressDREAD

Posts: 2326
Joined: 1/1/2004
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quote:

during or after a spenking session, she refuses to keep still but wiggles her bottom.

After such a scene Alan a cooldown period needs to be expected and established. putting a sub especially
a bratty sub in a corner after a scene with out a cool down period is next to cruel. she is still comming down
and needs your Dominant attention at this point. bratty subs need more attention then the normal sub but
I do agree with John, establish Your bounderies and if they are not followed a new assessment might be needed.

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